Yes that's right. It is to present sexual fetish being used as a defence for domestic violence. THe injured person would be convicted too.
As for the law regarding violent porn, it is possession that constitutes the offence and it is a sexual offence so you would get added to the register of sex offenders, which would be nice.
If I recall, one of the main points that stood out about Spanner was that - despite what most people might assume - consent is NOT a defence. You will still be prosecuted for injuring someone, even if they have given their consent to the activity.
Good point about the images, too. I think we should keep this in mind with Photo Moderation. Anything that blatantly mixes sex with graphic violence (eg: blood and nudity) should be classified as "Shock photo: Blood, gore, real torture, etc." ... and rejected.
There is a principle of European law that a level of violence exists to which consent is deemed to be invalid. It followed a case (the Spanner case) involving a bunch of gay BDSM enthusiasts where a wild sex party was video'd and the footage got into the hands of the police. Several of the attendees were jailed. The law that emerged is that trifling marks were OK but anything else was assault and the "injured" person was liable to conviction for conspiracy.
Is wrestling so different? In an unregulated, often sexually fuelled arena I wonder how the law would view a serious injury. Let's say that the sleeper hold doesn't kill but induces a heart attack or brain haemorrage. Or let's even say that it causes a neck to break. Would the ambulanceman call the police? Yes probably. Would they consider charges? Yes probably? Would the charges stick? Quite possibly.
This is a great site for enthusistic fighters and I doubt that the law would penalise genuine accidents incurred while play fighting, but choke fans and NHB fans really need to have an eye on the law because, as Sturdy says, the consequences could be lasting if it can be shown that the intention was to engage in high risk or illegal activities.
Also beware of images of violent fighting that has a sexual content as possession of these can also be a criminal offence in the same way that violent S&M porn can be illegal. Secton 63 of the Criminal Justice and Immigration Act 2008 applies.
If you restrict the supply of oxygen to a person'e brain, either by a choke or strangle, that person can DIE.
You can both be horny and turned on by the whole fetish kink but the situation can very quickly turn into something very different.
Just picture this: You are sitting there in your speedos, your lycra posing pouch or whatever fetish gear you like to dress up in, and lying against your chest is a DEAD BODY which is slowly going cold.
What are you going to do? Call an ambulance? Yes, you should. And they will turn up, eventually. Will you change into something more dignified before they arrive? Or will you answer the door in your bright yellow speedos?
The paramedics will do their best, but you will see the look of resignation in their eyes as they fail to resuscitate him. This is a nightmare. But it's real.
The police will arrive. They will be very efficient and correct. They will even call you 'Sir' as they ask you to explain what has happened. But you will see the same look in their eyes.
They will ask you if the dead man has any relatives you can contact. You don't know; you never discussed that. But now you are thinking to yourself - I have just killed someone's son. Maybe someone's dad.
The body will be photographed. You will be taken to the police station. Probably released on bail the next day. But it will just be the beginning of the nightmare.
And it will be a nightmare that you will NEVER wake up from.
All good points on here. Maybe clear with your opponent before a bout, fun or serious, if chokeholds are to be allowed and agree how they should be applied.
I have certainly felt dizzy in a chokehold but didn't think it might ultimately be dangerous. I'm wiser from this discussion so thanks all round!
In unregulated competition it's totally down to the competitor who's being choked to tap and the one applying it to release soon as he feels the tap. Without a ref it can never be truly safe but men often get caught ^in a wave of manliness and refuse to tap, this is a huge mistake. As soon as you realise your not getting out, tap. Your opponent will, 90% of the time, will release you, if he's the minority that doesn't, he's no respect and isn't not worth your time
That's why I asked the question. I am concerned that restricting the flow of blood, even in a controlled situation, is dangerous and can lead to chokes or heart attacks.
I used to race motorbikes. I was trained and skilled and practiced. I raced on well maintained tracks with marshalls and paramedics. But I still crashed and fractured a vertebra. I know two other racing club members who were killed and plenty who were injured.
However unlike motorbike racing I suspect that the UK law may not be so understanding when it comes to wrestling. After all what we here do is mainly unregulated. So if it is the case that it cannot be done in safety (in this case safety = complete safety, not mostly safe) it is dangerous and should not be attempted.
Couple of things. A "Choke" (when you restrict someone's air flow by squeezing a windpipe) can be very dangerous; the human windpipe is rather fragile and easily crushed, causing major complications. In fact, in stage combat you usually never see an attacker "choking" someone by placing his thumbs across the windpipe because of the inherent danger of that move.
"Sleepers" (a legitimate move from judo and jui-jitsu) are different in that they restrict the flow of blood to a person's brain, rendering him unconscious. Unfortunately, "sleepers" are sometimes refered to as "blood chokes" or "Rear Naked Chokes" which confuses the issue.
Although the "RNC"/"sleeper" is a legitimate hold and effective, it probably shouldn't be applied unless the person applying it knows what he is doing (and NOT from seeing it done on WWE/WWF/WCW/TNA) and the person having it applied completely trusts the one doing it. It probably shouldn't be done unless there is a 3rd person (a ref) who is watching to make sure the guy taps out and the person applying it stops IMMEDIATELY. I know of a black belt judoka who suffered a major stoke from having a "RNC" applied to him in training!
I think they can definitely be applied safely - just be careful how much pressure is applied and think about where your arms/hands are in relation to the opponent's windpipe.
Ironbull (94)
1/26/2012 12:23 PMYes that's right. It is to present sexual fetish being used as a defence for domestic violence. THe injured person would be convicted too.
As for the law regarding violent porn, it is possession that constitutes the offence and it is a sexual offence so you would get added to the register of sex offenders, which would be nice.
Sturdy (31)
1/25/2012 7:49 PMVery good points, Bull.
If I recall, one of the main points that stood out about Spanner was that - despite what most people might assume - consent is NOT a defence. You will still be prosecuted for injuring someone, even if they have given their consent to the activity.
Good point about the images, too. I think we should keep this in mind with Photo Moderation. Anything that blatantly mixes sex with graphic violence (eg: blood and nudity) should be classified as "Shock photo: Blood, gore, real torture, etc." ... and rejected.
Ironbull (94)
1/25/2012 2:26 PMTo pick up Sturdy's points:
There is a principle of European law that a level of violence exists to which consent is deemed to be invalid. It followed a case (the Spanner case) involving a bunch of gay BDSM enthusiasts where a wild sex party was video'd and the footage got into the hands of the police. Several of the attendees were jailed. The law that emerged is that trifling marks were OK but anything else was assault and the "injured" person was liable to conviction for conspiracy.
Is wrestling so different? In an unregulated, often sexually fuelled arena I wonder how the law would view a serious injury. Let's say that the sleeper hold doesn't kill but induces a heart attack or brain haemorrage. Or let's even say that it causes a neck to break. Would the ambulanceman call the police? Yes probably. Would they consider charges? Yes probably? Would the charges stick? Quite possibly.
This is a great site for enthusistic fighters and I doubt that the law would penalise genuine accidents incurred while play fighting, but choke fans and NHB fans really need to have an eye on the law because, as Sturdy says, the consequences could be lasting if it can be shown that the intention was to engage in high risk or illegal activities.
Also beware of images of violent fighting that has a sexual content as possession of these can also be a criminal offence in the same way that violent S&M porn can be illegal. Secton 63 of the Criminal Justice and Immigration Act 2008 applies.
restle (31)
1/23/2012 10:07 PMthink im most convinced by Sturdy`s argument on this issue. Doesn`t seem to me to be a safe thing to do. Like chokeholds but sleepering goes too far
Sturdy (31)
1/23/2012 1:48 PMWe need to be 100% clear about this:
CHOKING AND STRANGLING CAN KILL
If you restrict the supply of oxygen to a person'e brain, either by a choke or strangle, that person can DIE.
You can both be horny and turned on by the whole fetish kink but the situation can very quickly turn into something very different.
Just picture this: You are sitting there in your speedos, your lycra posing pouch or whatever fetish gear you like to dress up in, and lying against your chest is a DEAD BODY which is slowly going cold.
What are you going to do? Call an ambulance? Yes, you should. And they will turn up, eventually. Will you change into something more dignified before they arrive? Or will you answer the door in your bright yellow speedos?
The paramedics will do their best, but you will see the look of resignation in their eyes as they fail to resuscitate him. This is a nightmare. But it's real.
The police will arrive. They will be very efficient and correct. They will even call you 'Sir' as they ask you to explain what has happened. But you will see the same look in their eyes.
They will ask you if the dead man has any relatives you can contact. You don't know; you never discussed that. But now you are thinking to yourself - I have just killed someone's son. Maybe someone's dad.
The body will be photographed. You will be taken to the police station. Probably released on bail the next day. But it will just be the beginning of the nightmare.
And it will be a nightmare that you will NEVER wake up from.
turpin (71)
9/24/2011 3:47 PMAll good points on here. Maybe clear with your opponent before a bout, fun or serious, if chokeholds are to be allowed and agree how they should be applied.
I have certainly felt dizzy in a chokehold but didn't think it might ultimately be dangerous. I'm wiser from this discussion so thanks all round!
MattMelia (18)
9/21/2011 9:25 PMIn unregulated competition it's totally down to the competitor who's being choked to tap and the one applying it to release soon as he feels the tap. Without a ref it can never be truly safe but men often get caught ^in a wave of manliness and refuse to tap, this is a huge mistake. As soon as you realise your not getting out, tap. Your opponent will, 90% of the time, will release you, if he's the minority that doesn't, he's no respect and isn't not worth your time
Ironbull (94)
9/20/2011 2:56 PMThat's why I asked the question. I am concerned that restricting the flow of blood, even in a controlled situation, is dangerous and can lead to chokes or heart attacks.
I used to race motorbikes. I was trained and skilled and practiced. I raced on well maintained tracks with marshalls and paramedics. But I still crashed and fractured a vertebra. I know two other racing club members who were killed and plenty who were injured.
However unlike motorbike racing I suspect that the UK law may not be so understanding when it comes to wrestling. After all what we here do is mainly unregulated. So if it is the case that it cannot be done in safety (in this case safety = complete safety, not mostly safe) it is dangerous and should not be attempted.
JasonFL (21)
9/20/2011 5:34 AMCouple of things. A "Choke" (when you restrict someone's air flow by squeezing a windpipe) can be very dangerous; the human windpipe is rather fragile and easily crushed, causing major complications. In fact, in stage combat you usually never see an attacker "choking" someone by placing his thumbs across the windpipe because of the inherent danger of that move.
"Sleepers" (a legitimate move from judo and jui-jitsu) are different in that they restrict the flow of blood to a person's brain, rendering him unconscious. Unfortunately, "sleepers" are sometimes refered to as "blood chokes" or "Rear Naked Chokes" which confuses the issue.
Although the "RNC"/"sleeper" is a legitimate hold and effective, it probably shouldn't be applied unless the person applying it knows what he is doing (and NOT from seeing it done on WWE/WWF/WCW/TNA) and the person having it applied completely trusts the one doing it. It probably shouldn't be done unless there is a 3rd person (a ref) who is watching to make sure the guy taps out and the person applying it stops IMMEDIATELY. I know of a black belt judoka who suffered a major stoke from having a "RNC" applied to him in training!
turpin (71)
9/19/2011 6:26 PMI think they can definitely be applied safely - just be careful how much pressure is applied and think about where your arms/hands are in relation to the opponent's windpipe.
And if you're put in one - be safe and tap out!! We all want to be able to wrestle again tomorrow! Please log in to view gallery photos.
fmrhugger (17)
9/19/2011 2:33 AMForget what you see on WWE. They can be safely applied WITH CARE.
SileX (197 )
9/19/2011 12:53 AMYes, they can.
Ironbull (94)
9/18/2011 12:21 PMCan they be applied safely? What do you all think?